Anti-Hindu dogmas from Karan Thapar
Great men make great mistakes. Karan Thapar is not a great man. However, he has made great mistakes in his article “Who is the real Hindu” published in The Hindustan Times. Here are the Karan Thapar dogmas and my replies.
Dogma 1). “Does the VHP have the right to speak for you or I?”
Reality: Yeah, VHP has done a lot of service to Hindu activities unlike armchair intellectuals like you. They have gone deep into the forests and have saved a number of Hindus from the proselytising arms of Islam and Christianity. If Swami Vivekananda and Mahatma Gandhi were alive, they would have been proud of VHP. By the way, what have you done for Hinduism, Mr. Thapar, why should you have the right to speak for you or I?
Dogma 2. Do they reflect our views? Do we endorse their behaviour? They call themselves the Vishwa Hindu Parishad, but who says they represent all of us?”
Reality: They represent authentic Hindus and not pseudosecular Hindus like you.
Dogma 3. “This Sunday morning, I want to draw a clear line of distinction between them and everyone else. My hunch is many of you will agree.”
Reality: So you want to divide Hinduism. I don’t agree with you. I agree with VHP which wants to unite Hindus. So what is your problem.
Dogma 4. “Let me start with the question of conversion – an issue that greatly exercises the VHP”
Reality: It greatly exercised not just the VHP. It also greatly exercised one Mahatma Gandhi and one Swami Vivekananda. It also greatly exercises the common Hindus.
Dogma 5. “I imagine there are hundreds of millions of Hindus who are peaceful, tolerant, devoted to their faith, but above all, happy to live alongside Muslims, Christians, Sikhs, Buddhists, Jains and Jews.”
Reality: Now I have to agree with you. You are imagining things. The history of Islam and Christianity is soaked in blood. The American historian Will Durant described Mohammedan conquest of India as the bloodiest story in the history of mankind. No Hindu is happy to live alongside Muslims. Why don’t you move over to Taliban, Regarding Christian atrocities, you would do well to read Bertrand Russell, Mr. Thapar. Besides, Sikhs and Buddhists are a part of the greater Hindu Samaj. Your pseudosecular moves at dividing Hindu society does not impress anyone.
Dogma 6. “If any one of us were to change our faith how does it affect the next man or woman? ”
Reality: Great. Now our progressive Karan Thapar is supporting medieval Christianity and Islam. And he has now proved himself to be a greater fool. Well, Christianity and Islam are medieval faiths and converting to these faiths not just makes us one man less but one enemy more. Remember, Hindus are Kafirs in Islamic parlance and heathens in Christian parlance. So Islam and Christianity are intolerant faiths and they just cannot tolerate the idolator Hindu. If you don’t understand such a simple logic, you are unfit to call yourself an intellectual, Mr. Thapar. I will now quote Thomas Jefferson, the former US President “Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined, imprisoned; yet we have not advanced an inch towards uniformity. …were the Pope, or his allies, to send in mission to us some thousands of Jesuit priests to convert us to their orthodoxy, I suspect that we should deem and treat it as a national aggression on our peace and faith.”
Dogma 7. “And even if that happens with inducements, it can only prove that the forsaken faith had a tenuous and shallow hold.” “So why do the VHP and its unruly storm troopers, the Bajrang Dal, froth at the mouth if you, I or our neighbours convert? What is it to do with them? Let me put it bluntly, even crudely. If I want to sell my soul – and trade in my present gods for a new lot – why shouldn”t I? ”
Reality: Well, Mr. Thapar, authentic Hindus are not cheap like you. They value their soul and don’t sell it. So when the Islamists/Christians try to dupe our innocent brothers with allurements, we are bound to stop them from getting denationalised. Surely, we don’t want ISI agents and FBI agents in our neighbourhood. Besides, Hinduism is a noble way of life and not a killer-cult like Islam and Christianity. We are proud of our tolerant faith unlike you who seems to be paid by medieval cultists.
Dogma 8. “Even if the act diminishes me in your eyes, it”s my right to do so. So if thousands or even millions of Dalits, who have been despised and ostracized for generations, choose to become Christian, Buddhist or Muslim, either to escape the discrimination of their Hindu faith or because some other has lured them with food and cash, it”s their right. ”
Reality: If you can support conversion, you should also support prostitution. A prostitute sells her body for cash, a converter sells his soul (I am sure you don’t have one, Mr.Thapar). Or else, you would not write so cheap. Regarding poverty among Dalits, I would like to tell you that poverty is a hang-over of Islamic-British-Nehruvian rule in India. They impoverished the entire Hindu soceity during their rule. And cheap intellectuals like you have the temerity to abuse Hindu faith while it is a historic fact that Muslims, Christians, Colonialists and Communists have been responsible for nation’s poverty.
Dogma 9: “Arguably you may believe you should ask them to reconsider, although I would call that interference but you certainly have no duty or right to stop them. In fact, I doubt if you are morally correct in even seeking to place obstacles in their way. The so-called Freedom of Religion Acts, which aim to do just that, are, in fact, tantamount to obstruction of conversion laws and therefore, at the very least, questionable.”
Reality: Mr. Thapar, you want the Hindus to be sitting duck to Christian/Islamic poachers. No way, get out of your dream land. We did not bend during the past 1,000 years of Islamic/Colonialist/Christian/Socialist rule. Nor will we bend in future. We have something called as self-respect which you seem to have sold somewhere down the line.
Dogma 10: “However, what”s even worse is how the VHP responds to this matter. Periodically they resort to violence including outright murder”
Reality: When compared to Islam/Christian violence in India, the VHP violence is a damp squib.
Dogma 11: What happened to Graham Staines in Orissa was not unique”
Reality: Staines was a cheap missionary who abused Hindu Gods. The masses gave him a fitting tribute for his action. That’s all. Staines had criminal record back home in Australia. He had cases against him registered by the Orissa police. He had a handgun with him during the time of his killing. Of course, the pseudosecular media did not report this because a white man’s life is more dear than a brown man’s life. Is it not?
Dogma 12: Last week it happened again. Apart from the utter and contemptible criminality of such behavior, is this how we Hindus wish to behave? Is this how we want our faith defended? Is this how we want to be seen? I have no doubt the answer is no. An unequivocal, unchanging and ever-lasting NO!”
Well, the Christians started it through their aggressive proselytisation and the killing of Lakshmananda. So educate yourself, Mr. Thapar.
Dogma 13: The only problem is it can”t be heard. And it needs to be. I therefore believe the time has come for the silent majority of Hindus – both those who ardently practice their faith as well as those who were born into it but may not be overtly religious or devout – to speak out.”
Reality: Yes, the time has come for the ordinary Hindus to speak against pseudosecularists in Indian media like you. You people have sold your soul to the west and are very keen on ditching Hindus and Hinduism. You only speak against Gujarat riots while ignoring Godhra. You only speak out against Hindu violence while ignoring Islamic/Christian/Communist genocides. The common Hindus should kick pseudosecularists like you. The time has come for that.
Dogma 14: “Indeed, they do not defend but shame Hinduism. That”s my central point.”
Reality: Shame. What kind of shame? Didn’t you feel ashamed when the Government twiddled its thumbs during jehadi attacks? Didn’t you feel ashamed when terrorists backed by Christians are running amok in North-East? Didn’t you feel ashamed when 3 lakh Kashmir Pandits were driven out of Kashmir? Why is your shame restricted to a few stray Hindu attacks? Why don’t you direct your shame to worthy issues?
Dogma 15: I”m sorry but when I read that the VHP has ransacked and killed I”m not just embarrassed, I feel ashamed. Never of being hindu but of what some Hindus do in our shared faith”s name.”
Reality: So, you felt happy when 3 lakh Kashmir Pandits were driven out of Kashmir. You felt happy when 58 Hindus were killed in Godhra. Why is your “Sorry” selective?
Dogma 16: “This is why it”s incumbent on Naveen Patnaik, Orissa”s Chief Minister, to take tough, unremitting action against the VHP and its junior wing, the Bajrang Dal.”
Reality: Why don’t you demand strict action against those anti-national proselytisers? Sure, you don’t have the balls to demand action against the violent minorities.
Dogma 17: This is a test not just of his governance, but of his character. And I know and accept this could affect his political survival. But when it”s a struggle between your commitment to your principles and your political convenience is there room for choice? For ordinary politicians, possibly, but for the Naveen I know, very definitely not. So let me end by saying: I”m waiting, Naveen. In fact, I want to say I”m not alone. There are hundreds of millions of Hindus, like you and me, waiting silently – but increasingly impatiently. Please act for all of us.”
Reality: So now you are trying to emotionally blackmail Naveen Patnaik. Well, I would like to say that 100s of millions of Hindus are with Bajrang Dal and VHP. They are supporters of masculine Hinduism and have rejected the namby-pamby pseudosecularism that Karan Thapar endorses.
Finally, an advice to Karan Thapar:
Grow up Soon. You are full of grey hair. Unfortunately, you stop short of wisdom.
Deepak Kamat is Editor in Chief of 'AseemaA', Journal for National Resurgence. Email: deepakastrologer@gmail.com
Fascist Trends in Indian Media
October 29th, 2008 at 2:47 am
dear all,
When the people who attain world pleasure(erupean & american) and live with that want come out refrain from that and want to have close relationship with india which means. They all who expereiced worldly pleasure which is not giving full satisfaction but there is a thing there which is awailable at India only.. be proud of it and follow our volues and practice it..
October 29th, 2008 at 2:58 am
Those who do not know saraswati purana, here it is;
“Saraswati Purana”.
Brahma used to collect his semen in a pot whenever he masturbated fixing his carnal eyes on the celestial beauty Urvasi.
Brahma’s semen which came out after lustful mastrbation in the pot gave birth to Saraswati.
This daughter of Brahma is saraswati, our goddess of learning. When Brahma saw the beauty of Saraswati he became amorous. To escape from her father’s passionate approach Saraswati ran to the lands in all four directions, but she could not escape from her father. She succumbed to Brahma’s wish. Brahma and his daughter Saraswati lived as husband and wife indulging in incest for 100 years.
They had a son Swayambhumaru.
Swayambhumaru made love with his sister Satarpa.
Through this incest of Brahma’s son and daughter Brahma got two grandsons and two grand-daughters.
October 29th, 2008 at 3:01 am
CAUSE AND EFFECT
Prajapati(Brahma) desired his daughter( SARASWATI) and made love to her. This was a sin in the eyes of the gods, who said to the god who rules over beasts [Pasupati, Rudra], ‘He commits a sin, acting in this way towards his own daughter, our sister. Pierce him.’ Rudra took aim and pierced him. Half his seed fell to the ground. The gods cured Prajapati and cut out Rudra’s dart, for Prajapati is the sacrifice. To utilize [the seed], the gods said, ‘Take care that this may not be lost, but that it may be less than the oblation.’ They gave it to Bhaga to eat, but it burnt his eyes and he became blind. Then they gave it to Pusan to eat, but it knocked out his teeth. At last they gave it to Savitr [the sun] and it did not injure him, for he appeased it.” —
Ref : Satapatha Brahmana 1:7:4:1-7.
October 29th, 2008 at 3:09 am
CREATION OF UNIVERSE ACCORDING TO HINDUISM
Unlike christians or muslims the world was not created in some days but by brahma by his natural instinct.
BRAHMA AND CREATION OF UNIVERSE
“Prajapati desired his daughter( SARASWATI) and made love to her. This was a sin in the eyes of the gods, who said to the god who rules over beasts [Pasupati, Rudra], ‘He commits a sin, acting in this way towards his own daughter, our sister. Pierce him.’ Rudra took aim and pierced him. Half his seed fell to the ground. The gods cured Prajapati and cut out Rudra’s dart, for Prajapati is the sacrifice. To utilize [the seed], the gods said, ‘Take care that this may not be lost, but that it may be less than the oblation.’ They gave it to Bhaga to eat, but it burnt his eyes and he became blind. Then they gave it to Pusan to eat, but it knocked out his teeth. At last they gave it to Savitr [the sun] and it did not injure him, for he appeased it.” — Satapatha Brahmana 1:7:4:1-7.
“That first being (Prajapati) became afraid; therefore one becomes afraid when one is alone. Then he thought to himself: ‘Of what should I be afraid, when there is no one but me?’ So his fear left him, for what was he going to be afraid of? One is, after all, afraid of another. He found no pleasure at all; so one finds no pleasure when one is alone. He wanted to have a companion. Now he was as large as a man and a woman in close embrace. So he split his body into two, giving rise to husband (pati) and wife (patni). … He (Prajapati) copulated with her, and from their union human beings were born. She then thought to herself: ‘After begetting me from his own body, how could he copulate with me? I know — I’ll hide myself.’ So she became a cow. But he became a bull and copulated with her. From their union cattle were born. Then she became a mare, and he a stallion; she became a female donkey, and he, a male donkey. And again he copulated with her, and from their union one-hoofed animals were born. Then she became a female goat, and he, a male goat; she became an ewe, and he, a ram. And again he copulated with her, and from their union goats and sheep were born. In this way he created every male and female pair that exists, down to the very ants. … Then he churned like this and, using his hands, produced fire from his mouth as from a vagina. As a result the inner sides of both these — the hands and the mouth — are without hair, for the inside of the vagina is without hair.” — Brhadaranyaka Upanisad 1:4:2-6.
EVEN THE FEMALE FORM OF GOD BRAHAMA WAS SO ASHAMED OF HAVING SEX WITH BRAHMA THAT SHE RAN AWAY, BUT BRAHAMA KEPT ON PURSUING HER AND RAPED HER AGAIN AND AGAIN A MILLION TIMES OR MORE TO PRODUCE ALL THE CREATION OR LIVING THINGS ON EARTH ???
October 29th, 2008 at 3:11 am
EASWAR>>They all who expereiced worldly pleasure which is not giving full satisfaction but there is a thing there which is awailable at India only>>
They all go to Goa for Marijuana. They all visit the tourist places, cos Dollar can buy lot more for them. How many foreigner you could see in Tirupathi/Puri temples? Yeh, they hop in Osho Ashram for sexology!!
In tourist arrival France Rank 1, ITALY/Vatican #4 , Saudi#29 and India at 35th rank. And the no of Indians who go out to seek job in west is much higher!! I dont find any statistical support in your statement.
October 29th, 2008 at 3:16 am
sapr 333
Dont try to genralise situation which is not normal any where in india..allindian are not bajrangee’s.
Now let me try to clear your all queries..
You must try to understand mainthing but heaven sake dont try to confuse yourself with many other matter….(like colur..bajrangee..vhp … all that)
If any thing happened to chritianissam… any mother therasa photo display… any critic over jesus …any thing about critianity whole cristiyanity will stood for and against it we have seen it many times….
even when photo come about praphet mh. md nabi sallalahu
there was huge agitation all cross world even pope finally ask for apology all that they also stood to gether.
for a example. in india one muslim men draw a photo of bharath math naked no who agitate but only so called bajangee.. again same muslim men forget that fellow name but drawn again a photo naked of lord saraswathi no one agitate but only bajrangee & vhp’s
Even Vhp dimalished babri masjid total india not supported vhp though we know that ayodia is main stream for indian heart yet we all indian dont take any thing serious. we have confidant over god will knows what to do and what not.. what ever happening is with blessing of god only happening so everthing will be good of universe. That is wat indian’s thought kindly appraisee writly dont try to hoodwing anything..
Will any indian shout at any other land pakistan or australia… you have seen people(indian) who live for more than 300 years in malasia started shouting for wright but they are all being torcher by the govt but govt of india keep queit but bajrangee and vhp’s against it… which mean they have no tollarence..
At the same time shri. jayalalitha started impose conversion bill all cristian muslim together and made big stage.. she taken back..
we agree and tollerate that any cristian abuse for indian god or anything smillarly in mask every where they are using shorp power ful speaker for their five time namas.. we never oppose it . Can they use any where same speaker other than india and muslim countries… becouse no tollarence…
Now you can understand the level of tollerence and linkgage between cristian muslim and bujrangees .. I indian very well say that there is similarity between you people and metality also same of bajrangees
October 29th, 2008 at 3:19 am
HINDUISM AND IDOL WORSHIP || OM ||
Idolatry does not find any support from Vedas. In chapter 32 of Yajurveda it has been said that God Supreme or Supreme Spirit has no ‘Pratima’ or material shape. He cannot be seen directly by anyone. His name is so great that only the Name is enough to invoke Him. He pervades all beings and all directions.
As God is formless and his name is enough, syllables comprising the words may, therefore, be taken as adequate representation. What God is like? The answer is, it is like the word ‘God’ containing the syllables G, O, D. The most striking example of this is the word ‘Om’ which means God in spiritual and material form. Thus according to the Vedas God neither has any image nor He resides in any particular idol or statue.
However we find that Hindu temples are filled with images or idols of gods and goddesses. This phenomenon can be easily understood if we try to know the necessity of assumptions. If we teach a child at nursery stage that ‘A’ stands for ‘apple’ we are making an assumption for easy learning of a letter of alphabet. While teaching geometry the teacher draws a triangle and says, “Let ABC be a triangle”. The word ‘let’ is used here because the lines forming the triangle are not really lines according to the definition of a line. A line, by definition, has length but no breadth. How to draw such a line on a blackboard? Breadth invariably accompanies length whenever one attempts to draw a line. Hence one has to use the word ‘let.’ One has to assume that what has been drawn is a line. Similarly, geometry asks us to assume a point also. A point is defined as having neither length, nor breadth nor thickness. It is without any dimension; still we try to draw it on a blackboard. What we draw is practically a circle, but it is assumed to be a point. A true triangle and a true point exist only in definitions. Yet we have to proceed on the assumption that they actually exist.
As the mind cannot concentrate itself on a formless being or spiritual form of Supreme Being one has to assume God in some visible object or image. During the Vedic period there were neither temples nor images or idols of deities. So God was invoked through the fire kindled for havan materials. The seers of Upanishads discarded the practice of havans and concentrated on Imperishable ‘Om’. When the Buddhism and Jainism flourished in India the idols or statues of Gautam Buddha and Vardhaman Mahavir got much popularity. To rejuvenate Hinduism different images of God varied in shape according to different names of God came into existence. One may say that it resulted in spread of superstition in Hinduism. Yet it is a fact that all temples, mosques, churches and other religious buildings are also idols and images where God does not come to reside. It is weakness of the man that he likes human shape. So majars (graves) of Sufi saints among Muslims and crucified figure of Jesus Christ in the churches command much reverence. In the same way personification of different names of God and giving different forms to them have helped sculptors to make statues or idols that may find place in temples to be adored by devotees.
We can say that idolatry, in whatever form it may be, is based on assumption that God comes to a sacred place (building) or resides in a statue. There is no harm in going to temples or other places of worship. There is also no harm in saluting the image or images of God. However it must be clear to every one that no temple or an idol kept there enjoys any supernatural power. As the spiritual form of Supreme Being cannot be conceived through sense-organs and material form of Supreme Being (Virat) is the cosmos which also cannot be fathomed by the mind, so a devotee may concentrate on syllables or some image of his liking. As one’s folding of hands or touching of feet to give reverence to one’s father and mother actually reaches them; so any salute or reverence shown to an image thinking that the salute or reverence is meant for God really goes to God.
October 29th, 2008 at 3:35 am
In eroup and america no (mainly youngster) one go for church hence they started practicing yoga & assana’s you know. when they try to stop it people not coming again they intruduce it… no one can hide any thing
October 29th, 2008 at 3:42 am
Easwar>>sake dont try to confuse yourself with many other matter….(like colur..bajrangee..vhp … all that)>>>
I agree with you. While debating with you I will not drag these things. Apologize..
>>who live for more than 300 years in malasia started shouting >>
Its not alone Malaysia, this issue is there in SriLanka/ Tobaco Trinidad/South Africa/Fiji etc..This is an ethinic issue. And RSS turned it out Malaysian ethnic issue as Religious issue,but its silent when it comes to Tamils of SriLanka!!
>>>where they are using shorp power ful speaker for their five time namas.>>
Islam is no way related to Hindu tolerance..Its a religion founded by a human rights violator. Its a religion which stones to death for those who wants to try a new path to God.. So lets not talk about Islam.
>>any thing about critianity whole cristiyanity will stood for and against it we have seen it many times>>
Its a fundamental right to express your dis-interest,and every one is allowed to express their opposition within the limits of Constitution and law of land. But if they go on torching/raping/murder others, then thats intolerace & crime, which needs to be condemned.
>>Now you can understand the level of tollerence and linkgage between cristian muslim and bujrangees >>
Yourself make an analysis, and concluse, who n all in India is breaking the law to express their opposition?
October 29th, 2008 at 4:04 am
Easwar>>In eroup and america no (mainly youngster) one go for church hence they started practicing yoga & assana’s you know. when they try to stop it people not coming again they intruduce it… no one can hide any thing>>
A true Christian is not identified by his Church attendence..Its all about how he follows the Teachings of Jesus Christ.
And now, you want to identify Yoga with Hinduism, which a sad thing to stooping it too low. If you try to identify worldlymatters/cuture with a religion, you only stand to loose, cos Indian custom is fairly well westernised..Be it Trouser dress(Dhothi)/tie/Food Habits(Bread&Butter)/English Medicine(Ayurvedha)/ Macaulay(Gurukul) etc etc. Does it make sense!!
Yes, Yoga is a good breathing exercise and its good for health. We dont need any expensive TreadMills.. And the smart west, will easily pick up the best. You may be surprised, it could be added in American Schools Physical education academics too. Yoga training CD’s have already filled the American stores, and you dont need any concept of God to do yoga exercise.
But I will always question its spirituality aspect!!!
October 29th, 2008 at 10:44 am
Sapr 333
Yes, Yoga is a good breathing exercise and its good for health. We dont need any expensive TreadMills.. And the smart west, will easily pick up the best. You may be surprised, it could be added in American Schools Physical education academics too. Yoga training CD’s have already filled the American stores, and you dont need any concept of God to do yoga exercise.
But I will always question its spirituality aspect!!!
Let me try to explain not my own discovered by rishis
yoga.. start with pranayama prathiyagara tharanath.. samsashtanga…
Let me explain linkage spirituality aspect :
Now basic of pranayama breathing : At the time of sleep can you see..can you hear…. can you smell.. can you feel..You have to say no no no only… correct.. All of our senses has gone to some where and settle there peacefully..
but only sense which is there is breathing rest of this everything settle some where. So its clear that in all sense brathing is head (main) so that our rishis try to control breath. By control of Head (breath) all other tail senses will be controled. All other senses is mainly used for worldly matter to refrain from worldly matter and to reach of highst level of state they discover pranayama… other prathiyagara..dharana.. samathi cant be explain which you have to experience thro. Acharya Guru I will not explain here… if you really want to know ..you just get in touch with me
October 29th, 2008 at 11:34 am
Easwar-TRICHY>>At the time of sleep can you see..can you hear…. can you smell.. can you feel..You have to say no no no only… correct.. All of our senses has gone to some where and settle there peacefully..>>
Yes, I have no second thoughts about Yoga-Breath Exercise on bodily matters. I practise it too. The point here is, how much it can help on spiritual matter..
To control the senses, Marijuana(ganja) helps a lot than holding breath, and even god shiva is portrayed in that posture. hallucination is all what you are talking about.. No smell,no sense, no sedation.. I’m not sure if you have heard this term “Erotic asphyxiation” where the teenagers forcibly hold the breath by covering their face with polythene bags,which gives them the height of sexual pleasures and a feeling of ‘Closer to death”..
Yoga.. we hold the breath, deprive Oxygen to brains, and enjoy the hallucination… Thats the ultimate called as ‘Raja Yoga”..Thats what doctors say too!!..Marijuana/LDX/Pethatin/Brown Sugar can take us there in an easy way..and be it a drug addict/Rishi,but both looks the same with strangled hairs and lost in life kinda..
Anyways, My basic question is… Is this the right way to reach God? Will God approve hallucination methods to commune with him..
PS: Give me sometime, I will google and post one of the finest articles written by Ravi of RZIM about yoga..
October 31st, 2008 at 12:08 pm
@ Sapr33,
Yoga is a system built to develop self-awareness which I am sure your exclusively franchised Christian God will not endorse.
November 3rd, 2008 at 9:35 am
Deepak Kamat
October 31st, 2008 at 12:08 pm
@ Sapr33,
Yoga is a system built to develop self-awareness which I am sure your exclusively franchised Christian God will not endorse.
Yoga is exercise and it is getting accepted world wide just as you wear red shirt in your photo instead of kurta and use english instead of sanskrit.
November 17th, 2008 at 3:19 am
After reading all these postings, as a common Hindu with no specific ideological or political affinity, I feel inclined to put forth my view points on some much debated issues raised here. Hope, these points would make some sense to all.
HINDUISM OR SANATANA DHARMA?
I feel, we Hindus are doing a grave mistake by limiting ourselves to a narrow identity which, I believe, was imposed upon us by the same groups who are now out to spit on our faces, calling us a bunch of primitive ignorant people. For them, our forefathers, including great rishis like Veda Vyasa who compiled all Vedas and Puranas, were no better than a bunch of primitive barbarians giving vent to their animalistic passions. They have given a narrow and limited meaning to the phrase Hinduism and we in our eagerness to defend ourselves are unwittingly falling into the trap of identifying ourselves with that narrow view. They read Vedas and Puranas and derive strange meanings out of them, that suit to their need to defile and denigrate. And we help them in their endeavor while trying to answer them in the very language, logic, and concepts used by them.
We have been told by our great rishis that Vedas are the repository of all knowledge. But, it is an established fact that metaphysical knowledge can neither be fully expressed through words nor can be fully perceived by using one’s intelligence. So, to consider Vedas as four volumes of books with some words written in them, is incongruous with the idea of they being the repository of all knowledge. Books, even all the books of the world taken together, can never claim to be the repository of all knowledge. A belief that a book of written words contains all knowledge in it, even if the words are directly coming from God is nothing but a blind belief. That is the reason for which traditionally Vedas were not codified in written words. They were passed on from generation to generation being memorized by ‘adhikaris’ (those who were considered worthy of reading, understanding and remembering).
Definitely, rishis are not a bunch of liars to declare Vedas as the repository of all knowledge. So, it implies that they hint at something more than books of written words. The knowledge is somewhere else, not just confined to the literal meanings of words written therein. Words reveal as well as conceal the intended meanings. They are just symbols established through usage to express meanings in a very limited sense. They can never bear the burden of those profound truths which they are supposed to express. Both the revealed as well as concealed meanings of the words are subjective, being relative to the state of consciousness of the interpreter. So, the meanings of the words of Vedas are to be explored and understood only at the high state of consciousness where they were revealed. They are to be realized through one’s intuitive realization. So, the repository of all knowledge is not the written words but that realized state of consciousness of the interpreter, the ‘adhikaris’. That is why Vedas are called ‘Apurusheya’ – impersonal, that which has not come from any one or more individual beings but from that high impersonal state of realization of seers i.e., rishis.
Keeping with this spirit Sanatan Dharma has not been confined to just a set of static ideas or practices enshrined in a few words of scriptures like Vedas. It has been a dynamic, living religion constantly renewing itself through the realization of this Vedic knowledge in the personal lives of its saints and seers. In other words, unlike the commonly accepted notion of religion, it is not based on a set of dogmas derived from a rigid set of injunctions codified in a printed format, but on the personal intuitive realizations of saints who have been living down the ages. History is witness, many great spiritual personalities like, Buddha, Mahavir Jain, Adi Shankaracharya, Sant Gyaneshwar, Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu, Guru Nanak, Sri Ramanujacharya, and in recent times, great masters like, Sri Ramakrishna Paramahansa, Sri Shyama Charan Lahiri Mahasaya and many others have continuously maintained the freshness of this great tradition by adding new meanings to its eternal teachings through their grand realizations. Those who believe that Hinduism i.e., Sanatana Dharma is based on some written texts of Vedas and Puranas show their lack of understanding of this living tradition of Sanatana Dharma. This misunderstanding is understandable because of their familiarity with a concept of religion based upon rigid allegiance to one or few holy texts, or more precisely, to the written words of those holy texts. If we go on defending ourselves against allegations resulting from this basic misunderstanding and hence are based upon misinterpretations of the written words of Vedas and Puranas we will not only go against the very interest of Sanatana Dharma we want to uphold but also will do grave injustice to the great tradition which we have inherited from our great forefathers.
If somebody is deriving some strange meanings out of the words of Vedas and Puranas I pity on him because since time immemorial millions have been taking inspirations from these sacred writings to feel great blessings in their lives.
One should bear in mind the relativity of language to the spiritual and cultural ethos of the society and culture of its origin. Sanskrit verses when translated into English, either because of the personal bias of the translator or because of the inherent difficulty to cross that barrier of cultural relativity, may give rise to some very odd meanings not intended in the original writings. All these, along with the zeal of the person who wants to quote it out of context, with a definite cynical purpose in mind, may be responsible for the distortion of the meaning of any writing.
I am sure, anyone having a reasonable understanding of Sanskrit language, if reads and tries to understand the portions quoted here in their proper contexts, will not at all feel inclined to derive any perverted meanings out of them.
WHO IS PRACTICING IDOLATRY?
A lot of discussions and criticisms are centered on the practice of so called ‘idolatry’. It is said Vedas don’t support this practice. I have not gone through all the four Vedas nor do I intend to do that in my eagerness to prove myself a better Hindu. I know, not mundane words but the actual spiritual principles I practice in my daily living carry more meanings for my spiritual growth. Of course, I have gone through some other much-read scriptures like Bhagavad Gita which are supposed to contain the essence of all other scriptures and have inspired millions all over the world. There I find clear support for the view of worshiping the unmanifested absolute in whatever form that may be appealing to one’s personal dispositions. I also find the examples of great saints like Sri Ramakrishna Paramahansa, Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu, Mira Bai and many others who could reach the state of ultimate God consciousness through worshiping God in form, concentrating upon His infinite attributes in a finite form of idol. Any one who is criticizing the worship of idols because they are not mentioned in Vedas I would ask him/her, “why he/she is so attached to the words of Vedas that he/she can not even see the living examples of so many saints who have shown in their own lives the efficacy of this simplest way of contacting the infinite through finite?” Is it because of his/her strong faith in the Vedic knowledge which even surpasses the faith of a devout Hindu like me and many others? Of course not, the motive is quite obvious.
To worship God through idols may not be written in the Vedas but surely the spirit of looking for God’s presence behind all outward material manifestations is very much there. Otherwise, so many great saints, who are living examples of Vedic knowledge, would not have adopted this principle as a part of their spiritual sadhana. And as I mentioned earlier, Hinduism does not rely so much upon a stale, fanatic allegiance to the literal meanings of words but maintains its freshness by exploring the hidden meanings of words in the realm of realization within one’s inner self. ‘Going back to Vedas’ does not necessarily mean going back to the expressed literal meanings of words but to the truth which is hidden behind them, which has to be explored through one’s own inner realization.
If one really wants to understand the efficacy of conceiving the inconceivable God through the imagery of idols one should practice it at least for few days or months without any pre-conceived bias, before criticizing it. At least, that much can be expected from a sincere critique with a true scientific temper – if you disbelieve in something know exactly why you disbelieve and if you believe you should also know the reasons for your belief.
For the information of all those who are not aware, Hindus worship idols but don’t practice the so called ‘idolatry’. They know that in ultimate sense God has no image; His infinite nature can not be confined to a limited material form of an idol; but even then he tries to conceive His infinite nature through the finite medium of an idol. Infinite has to be conceived through finite because our perception is not always equipped to directly conceive the infinite nature of God. But, once the worship and the ritual ‘visarjan’ (a ritual that symbolically makes devotee feel the formal withdrawal of Divine presence form idol) is over the images are considered nothing more than lifeless statues made of clay or any other matter.
I remember, in my childhood how we used to play with parts of images of Lord Ganesha during immersion ceremonies, without being chastised by elders for committing any sacrilege. Other day, I saw a video in YouTube in which a newly converted (from Hinduism to Islam) foreign lady, out of her over enthusiasm of newly converted faith, broke a clay statue of lord Ganesha into pieces by hammering. With her whole body and face covered with dark colored clothes the scene reminded me of an executioner carrying out the capital punishment to a condemned convict.
This mentality only shows one’s utter ignorance about a Hindu’s attitude towards the idols he/she worships. I wish, that confused lady, with such grave misunderstanding of religious values and with so much of fanaticism and hatred buried within her, would one day find her spiritual goal through her newly embraced religious beliefs. May God guide her soul!
Analyzing little deeply it becomes clear that in its real negative sense, practice of idolatry is nothing but giving importance to the objects of creations over the Creator i.e., being attached to the gross matter and its necessary corollary, the physical body. If the lady of YouTube video saw the statue of lord Ganesha as just a piece of matter and hence broke it into pieces whereas a devout Hindu would have conceived through it one aspect of the infinite God in the form of lord Ganesha, then in true sense, who is practicing idolatry here? If you make a sincere effort to feel His presence in all forms of material creation then how is it idolatrous? Imagine, somebody having a dogmatic belief of God staying somewhere in a far away heaven, and hence views everything that exists before him as nothing but gross matter, then does he not stand a better chance to slip into a state of blinding attachment to gross materialism i.e., idolatry?
GOD – PERSONAL AND IMPERSONAL:
Here, it is also pertinent to mention that Hindus don’t always put their God in an absolute, transcendental state which is beyond one’s conception, though they know that the ultimate nature of God is impersonal and transcendental. They love to perceive God as an extension of individuality, as a divine being with many personal attributes. For a Hindu the concept of God is both personal and impersonal. As a personal God He is someone very close to him, like one of his closest relatives. In this aspect, God is not always considered as perfect in all respects as that perfect God will not be approachable by a human being dipped in many a imperfections of life. So, his personal God errs like any other human being – gets angry, has love-hate relationship with His wife and so on. A personal God can be perceived in any form and the devotee can establish any kind of relationship with Him/Her as may be pleasing to his/her personal dispositions. The freedom and beauty of establishing this sort of relationship with God and divinizing the day to day living by making God a partner of almost all our human pursuits is something that can be realized only by putting it into practice. Is not religion meant to be lived in our daily living instead of being limited to the sphere of our thoughts or beliefs?
Those who make fun of Hindus’ Gods and derive pleasure in making slanderous remarks are requested to make sincere efforts to practice this most practical concept of personal God in their lives or at least visualize, if they can, the beauty of such personal relationship before making such derogatory remarks. By passing such comments one only shows one’s narrow, egotistic and unscientific attitude of belittling others without making any effort to understand others’ point of view.
HINDUISM WITH NO CLEAR-CUT PHILOSOPHICAL GROUNDING?
Somebody labeled another criticism against Hinduism on the ground that Hinduism does not have a clear-cut philosophy. I don’t think there is any need to be apologetic about it. In Sanatana Dharma the only thing that is eternally constant and hence ‘sanatana’ is the journey of individual soul to reach its goal – the ultimate realization of the eternal Truth. The nature and course of this journey itself is not fixed, and it should not be fixed as it would mean a strangulating uniformity, ignoring the diversity of human and socio-cultural conditions. So, we believe in infinite ways through which realization of the ultimate purpose of human existence can be attained. Not that we don’t have any clear-cut methods delineated for that. Those who want to see can see innumerable ways – starting from simple village roads to sophisticated national high ways, and even ‘path-less paths’ – to suit the need of one and all for undertaking their onward journeys. But Hindus consider that these ways are not the only and final. We believe that many more possible ways can be discovered and are in the process of being explored, and all of them, without any conflict, can fit into that great tradition called Sanatana Dharma.
Yes, in Hinduism there are apparent contradictions but these are necessary to make it universally approachable. We don’t believe in a false and superficial unity in the form of a belief in a set of dogmas. It accounts for the strength not weakness of Hinduism. It proves its broadness. Is not contradiction acceptable, nay necessary in a democratic set up? The fact that many contradictions coexist in it shows its inherent secular nature. But whoever sees this apparent contradiction should also see that all these apparently contradictory streams are ultimately united in one spirit, in the spirit of search for the ultimate.
PSEUDO SECULARISM:
Anyone who is prepared to rise above the rigid adherence to any dogma is most welcome to join this great tradition of Sanatana Dharma. Please don’t misunderstand; we don’t want you to lose your identity nor do we want you to forego your faith or belief system in which you have been born and brought up so far. What we simply want that don’t get so attached to a set of dogmas that it may stifle your individuality, seeking to realize its true nature. It is because of such attachment that one starts considering one’s way as the only justifiable way or the most superior and civilized way than others’. This mentality resulting from an egocentric and close view of loyalty to one’s religion sows seeds of communal hatred and goes against the very interest of human civilization. This even leads to further complication when being carried away by such a narrow view one individual or community does not hesitate to adopt unethical means to proselytize members of other communities, particularly the ones who are gullible to their fanatical rhetoric.
To claim that anybody is free to decide for him or her, or even to be gullible to accept another path, is to justify the rabid religious bigotry which is lurking behind such acts of conversions. Nor can the evils of cast exploitation be cited as rational justification for such unjust fanaticism. Fanaticism is fanaticism; it has no place in a democratic social order. There is no logic in justifying one evil on the ground of another evil. Because by applying this logic the world will be full of evil only. This false justification therefore, definitely hints at a pseudo claim of secularism and religious freedom while evading the very facts of reality. This unabashed display of religious fanaticism is a deliberate attempt to destroy the very tradition of Sanatana Dharma which believes in ‘Sarva Dharma Sambhava’ – coexistence of all religions. Our protest against such fanaticism is not just because of our overzealous attachment to a tradition but because of our sense of responsibility to preserve this eternal value fraught with a great hope for the future of human civilization.
If a concept of secularism in practice provides overt or covert legitimacy for the rigid adherence to dogmas and its subsequent manifestation in the form of fanatical zeal to convert others, it can never be supportive of a just social order; it is nothing but a counterfeit of the true spirit of secularism – a pseudo secularism. It is a very opportunistic design to hide a clearly diabolical process under the mask of an apparently sane outer motif.
Of course, one is free to preach and spread the teachings of one’s own religion. That gives each of us an opportunity to have wider options open before us and by intelligent use of those options to make our spiritual practice less cumbersome, and more effective while rising above the limitations imposed by a specific dogma. I have come across many Muslims and Christians who follow and practice some specific tenets of Hinduism in their lives while still remaining formally identified with their respective professed religions. It is a well accepted fact that there are many people all over the world who practice many specific Hindu beliefs without losing their original religious identity. What surprises me is why do some religions are so eager to formally convert others while giving little importance to spreading the actual practice of their religious teachings?
The motives of such conversions can never be justified on any other ground than the fanatical zeal to expand one’s religious hegemony. It is the outcome of same rigid adherence to a set of dogma, of an egotistic belief in the false superiority of one’s own religion. This fanatical zeal of expanding one’s religious empire in the name of preaching and spreading the teachings leads to superfluous division of society along religious lines and to its consequent social tensions. I say superfluous because, it tries to replace, mostly unsuccessfully, the well entrenched socio-cultural bonds evolved through a long span of history.
Is secularism meant to give one a choice to practice a belief system of one’s choice or to legitimize the forces active to divide the society on the superfluous ground of religious affiliations? Imagine, what great religious freedom it will imply when one is free to practice any teaching or a conglomeration of teachings of one’s own choice without being bothered by the taboo of being converted or by the fear of being declared as an ‘apostate’ or ‘heretic’. That is the ideal of ‘Sarva Dharma Sambhava’ – coexistence of all religions.
If a strange theory of conversion, craftily disguised as the legal right to preach one’s specific religious teaching, and hiding in its bosom the dreaded virus of religious hatred and fanaticism, gains legitimacy form a legally approved democratic principle called secularism, then is there any doubt in labeling this as pseudo secularism? Unfortunately, thanks to this pseudo secular set up, sometimes even Hindus also feel compelled and take recourse to, what they call ‘reconversion’, which has no precedence in their tradition.
In his characteristic style, Mr. Karan Thaper argues that “even if that (conversion) happens with inducements, it can only prove that the forsaken faith had a tenuous and shallow hold.” Does he mean that Hinduism should emulate others in establishing a strong hold upon its followers by introducing a religious law that will deliver death sentences to its ‘apostates’? Does he mean that it should induce paranoia among its followers by declaring that one who leaves this path shall be doomed for ever for his crime of being ‘heretic’? Can’t Mr. Thaper see that a strong hold upon the religious followers of a particular community is impossible without making fanatics out of them, without catering to their credulous beliefs through dogmatic indoctrination? And all these are very much against the concept of true secularism and religious freedom. I don’t blame Mr. Thaper for not being able to see this point when he blames Hindusim for its ‘tenuous and shallow hold’ upon its followers. This only presents before us another burning example of the mind-set of a pseudo secularist.
Mr. Thaper, it is not my intention to corner you. I am not a follower of any organization of Sangha Parivar and hence have no valid reason to do so. But as a simple Hindu and a common Indian I can not afford to close my eyes to the false arguments of a pseudo secularist like you. You can not escape from the responsibility of bringing the country to this state of chaos by hiding behind a false mask of secularism. My humble suggestion is please try to understand the great responsibility of a responsible journalist of the country as you are. Please rise above all personal biases and see the reality as it unravels before you. We all simple Indians have a great expectation from people like you.
STRENGTH LIES IN THE POWER OF SANATANA DHARMA:
But, to me, Mr. Thaper is very right on one point. We are going against the basic tenets of our eternal tradition of Sanatan Dharma by giving vent to our anger and frustration in a way not befitting to the great culture we have inherited from our forefathers. Though much of the allegations are mostly one-sided and blown out of proportion (by those who deem it their moral responsibility to uphold this pseudo secular set up just because they don’t try to understand its hollowness or don’t have the will to shake off their blind belief in this set up which have been passed on to them through the very education and cultural system to which they have been exposed to) we can not justify ourselves reacting in such unbefitting manner.
It is of course understandable that there is a pragmatic and immediate necessity to defend and in the process being compelled to offend the parties who are determined to put their nefarious designs into practice by all possible means. There is a need of the hour to put forth a strong masculine stand against such evil designs. But strength does not show being murderous and indiscriminate in display of anger. Rather this display of anger may show our weakness. Our strength lies in standing firm on our principles and being ready to defend ourselves when provoked. Attacking innocent people and destroying places of worships will go against our interest because by displaying such behavior we forget that we are fighting against religious bigotry not succumbing to the evils of religious fanaticism ourselves. This will prove suicidal for our purpose.
Let us be clear that we are not fighting to force others to accept a narrow religious identity; an identity that has been imposed upon us by others and hence does not befit us; but to preserve and spread the eternal values of Sanatana Dharma for the benefit of the whole mankind. Let us make a resolve not to forget this essential truth even for a moment.
If one goes through the postings on this page and analyses them objectively there is no need to look for further materials to substantiate the fact that the hydra-headed monster of religious bigotry is in action to destroy the very foundation of Sanatana Dharma. The extent of intolerance and fanaticism expressed here brings to the fore the reality of dogmatic beliefs one secretly nurtures within. The label to which this discussion has come down is well below the norms of rational mode of expressing one’s views. The misunderstandings and misinterpretations quoted here show some of the most sinister designs operating behind the scene. How do you expect one to maintain one’s sanity in the face of so much of deliberate display of insanity all around? However, we have to bear the unbearable and therein lies our strength.
We should not let go those eternal values which have been the unshakable pillars of this great tradition through many ups and downs of history, nor should we turn our back upon any challenge to our culture by showing our meekness. We have to take up all challenges bravely with strength and vigor, and our strength mostly lies in our firm grounding upon those eternal values which forms the core of our eternal tradition. We should learn to stand up with the heroic gesture of a lion then there will be no need to strike back with vengeance. It is disgraceful for a lion to feel perturbed by the howling of jackals.
LET US REGAIN OUR IDENTITY:
The first and foremost requirement is to come out of this narrow identity of adherence to a concept of close religion imposed upon us from outside. It is not akin to our great tradition of Sanatana Dharma. Practically speaking, we also don’t have a set of closely defined dogmas to adhere with and that proves only our strength not weakness. In this case, there is no need to emulate others as that will prove self-defeating for our purpose. We have to establish our true identity and get rid of the habit of visualizing our faces in the molds of others’. Rather we should take upon ourselves the mantle of all-encompassing Sanatana Dharma.
Like others we too have our weaknesses – evils of caste system etc. – for which a lot have been done but thanks to the system we have inherited from our colonial masters, and to our politicians, they have not shown their results in our socio-cultural set up. Without blaming others for pointing their fingers at our weak spots let us be active to get rid of them.
NOT TO BE REACTIVE TO BASELESS CRITICISMS:
Last but not least, we should remember that ours is a living tradition which draws its sustenance from saints and masters who have realized the truth of scriptures in their personal lives, not from the mundane words enshrined in the scriptures. In our culture a saint does not need to be canonized i.e., to be confirmed in accordance with the dogmatic laws of Christian Church, before he can be called a saint; but a saint is saint in his own merit and it is he who lends credibility to the scriptural writings, not vice versa. Why is it necessary to prove the genuineness of a saint by subjecting him to evaluation under some rigid religious laws maintained through formally approved scriptures? Is it necessary to ascertain the genuineness of Sun by subjecting it to some manmade fixed criteria established through customs? Truth, like Sun, shines in its own light and that is the best proof of its genuineness. But, here there is a clue to understand the basic difference between the tradition of Sanatana Dharma and other world religions i.e., difference between the allegiance to truth realized and exemplified in the lives of so many saints and seers, and the dogmatic beliefs in the words of truth as narrated in the dogmas maintained through holy texts or scriptures.
We believe that the true meaning of the words of scriptures can be revealed to and interpreted by only such men of realizations who have reached that state of consciousness where they were originally revealed. So, is there any need to get carried away by misinterpretations of those words, done by some zealous fanatics with the obvious motive of maligning our age-old tradition?
SUBLIMATING NOT ESCAPING:
Our religion has been bold in facing the realities of life and finding out most practical and permanent solutions to the problems of daily living. For example, sex was never considered as a taboo in our culture. That healthy and divine attitude towards sex was responsible for building up a culture where even amorous poses depicted on the temple walls never diminished the sanctity and divinity of temples in the mind of a common Hindu. Imagine, what hue and cry it will generate if one plans to build a temple now with such amorous carvings. Is it because we are more civilized now and hence don’t mind giving free license to irrational sexual behavior in our general social and private life while being careful to keep it away from our so called religious and spiritual arena? Or is it because of our pseudo civilized culture with a distorted attitude towards sex as a means of crude physical enjoyment and hence has no place in our religious and spiritual beliefs? Is the purpose of religion limited to give us a mere psychological satisfaction without having any direct relevance to the life we lead, to the problems and challenges we face in our daily living? The concept of religion and spirituality that is broadly prevalent all over the world now can hardly provide us with any effective tool to face these challenges and to sublimate our basic human instincts in order to get the taste of that eternal joy, we all are aspiring for. Religion is now treated as something that can do nothing more than giving an extra superficial identity of belonging to a larger community, or providing a set of fixed beliefs and dogmas to live with.
Coming back to the point of amorous poses on the temple walls, these amorous images were invariably carved on the outer walls of temples, not in the inner walls of sanctum sanctorum, as reminder of two important points:
First, not escaping but accepting the reality of sex in the general scheme of life and developing a healthy attitude towards it. By carving them on the outer walls of holy places like temples the message was clear that by indulging in it in accordance with the divine plan of creation it can be considered as a part of the divine scheme of life. This was the first lesson to be learnt in channelizing this energy towards the higher goal of God realization. Without proper channelization it will keep one bound to material pleasures and hence outside the temple of inner joy.
Second, as one learns to channelize this energy towards higher goals and enters inside to contact the indwelling God enshrined within (symbolic of soul joy of one’s own inner temple) the charm of sexual pleasures naturally drops off after gaining access to the store-house of eternal joy, thousand times more enjoyable than the so called sexual pleasures.
With great scientific zeal our fore-fathers had undertaken wonderful experiments to unravel the mystery of sex energy. We didn’t adopt a false moral approach of running away form this hard reality of life. Our great rishis discovered some most practical and scientific methods to sublimate this sex force to realize the ultimate joy every man and woman is aspiring for. Sexual pleasures can be transmuted and sublimated to achieve the ultimate blissful experience of life is something that may not be intelligible to those who don’t want to come out of their so called scientific but perverted attitude towards this most important factor of life and put this amazing principle into practice in their own lives.
With this healthy attitude we respected womanhood as motherhood and never felt the need to hide them from toe to head. Sadly enough, now our tradition has been so contaminated by so called imported values of freedom and open society that in place of that healthy and divine attitude towards sex we now want to establish a system which would legalize a perverted sexual behavior between same genders.
NATION BUILDING:
No more mudslinging; if we really want to make this country, nay the whole world a large family we have to let each follow his own path and to support one another in order to make collective progress towards the ultimate goal of life. Diabolical designs to take advantage of somebody’s weakness and to draw him into one’s own fold with an egoistic and fanatical belief in the exclusive greatness of one’s own path has no place in this noble scheme.
A HUMBLE REQUEST:
Finally, a humble request to all those who are sincere in protecting the eternal values of Hinduism – Sanatana Dharma: You can not escape from your responsibility of promoting a culture wherein genuine sadhaks and renunciants of all different paths and religions will have their rightful places, as it has always been in our tradition of Sanatanan Dharma since time immemorial; because, these gems of men and women form the very backbone of this great tradition.
My suggestion is to look for those genuine sadhaks, and men and women of realization, to whatever faith and religion they may belong; convince them of your noble motive; take their blessings and wise guidance to spearhead a struggle against the monster of religious hatred and bigotry that is constantly eating away the vitality of our great mother land. I am sure, they will have no objection to be united under the egis of Sanatana Dharma as they have already transcended the bondage of being identified with any closed dogmatic belief system. Keeping them as the vanguard of your movement you can attract all to be united under the banner of Sanatana Dharma and can revive a new spirit of resurgence and fraternity among all, irrespective of religion, caste, creed and sex. That will be the day when our dear motherland will be established in her pristine glory, once again. And then, the day will not be far enough, when the utopia of heaven called ‘Vasudhaiva Kutumbakam’ would descend down to our mother earth.
Vande Mataram!
November 17th, 2008 at 3:29 am
Bnp,
thanks & agree to it… you can see more
Here…
There is a new comment on the post “Pope should apologise for Laxmanananda murder”.
http://greathindu.com/2008/10/pope-should-apologise-for-laxmanananda-murder/
November 22nd, 2008 at 12:13 am
First of all .. and last of all.. peace ..love.. the answer will come 2 u.. swami vivekanand was a gr8 guy.. some say god incarnate.. i believe he was a gr8 guy.. much better than us ordinary folks.. if u truly understand him or hinduism..whose greatest virtue is that it is not a religion.. it exceeds the boundaries of ordinary religion and faith.. it is a philosophy- a way of life- a means of manifestation of true potential of human being(notice how it is human being not human doing or human following but human being) .It lets you choose ..it lets you choose.. it lets you be.. nothing is right or wrong .. there are only consequences.. it just ‘is’. just ‘is’ ..So if u think karan thapar has in him 2 defame hinduism which is d most liberal ‘philosphy’ in the world you r denigrating the beauty of hinduism by assuming it can be debased by a person..it has stood d test of time for 5 thousand years ..it has stood true to its true value for 5 millenia.. And i am not saying karan thapar is right or wrong I dont care..What I care about is any of you guys thinking Hinduism needs u 2 protect it.. common seriously ..u think any soul on earth is capable of defaming any religion any in the world and especially a 5 millenia old 1 like ours..sorry not religion a 5 thousand old philosophy of life like ours..
November 22nd, 2008 at 12:56 am
Hindus (including Jains and Budhists) who are tired of pseudo-secular governments and media are invited to join Swabhimaan – a movement launched to unite Hindus of India and protect their interests. For more details please contact Swabhimaan2008@gmail.com
STRENGTHEN US WITH YOUR PARTICIPATION
November 24th, 2008 at 12:07 pm
Sabash…bnp…you said it….
…we have all but lost the original illumination of the Vedas…but the Mahatmas of Hinduism…they keep coming and they give the thrust of the Vedas to everyone….how many great men of sterling spirit have rescued the light of this great truth…Sri Aurobindo says that the soul force of Swami Vivekananda is stll working on the spirit of India…It is…All happiness comes from the soul…and the source of the soul is in the heart..there is nothing to worry…let us rise..in a spiritual way…to foster the truth of India…the truth that every human life is valuable and an opportunity to grow in spirit…Hinduism must be protected because it values plurality…multiplicity…a million ways to the divine….a billion philosophies…with the underpinning of unity….
November 24th, 2008 at 12:53 pm
KumarSK>>In our culture a saint does not need to be canonized i.e., to be confirmed in accordance with the dogmatic laws of Christian Church, before he can be called a saint; but a saint is saint in his own merit and it is he who lends credibility to the scriptural writings, not vice versa. Why is it necessary to prove the genuineness of a saint by subjecting him to evaluation under some rigid religious laws maintained through formally approved scriptures? Is it necessary to ascertain the genuineness of Sun by subjecting it to some manmade fixed criteria established through customs? >>>>
If we got to decide someone ‘Mr.Perfect”, then Hitler would have become first with full majory of the mass claiming his ideology as right. Saddam was a saint for Iraqi’s.. BIn-Laden for Moslems. Narendra modi would get higher votes than Mother Teresa/Gandhi.
This is exactly what I was talking about.. To distinguish good and bad, there must be a universal reference, which could only from God, not people’s voice/choice of making a Rishi great, as you claim to be. Given a chance, Modi,Sarvarkar,Mussolini,Hitler,Idi-Amin would also become Rishis by people’s voices..
Thats one reason, cannonization is a must..Ie, a selection of good man, in line with the nature of God, possibly, teachings of Jesus Christ.
PS: I enjoyed your post though
November 24th, 2008 at 1:01 pm
XYZ>> swami vivekanand was a gr8 guy.. some say god incarnate>>>>
If he was godly and universal in nature, he wouldnt have used the divide and rule to proclaim “Kerala was a lunatic assylum’.. That was the harsh word used by Vivekananda.
>>u think any soul on earth is capable of defaming any religion any in the world and especially a 5 millenia old 1 like ours..sorry not religion a 5 thousand old philosophy of life like ours..>>
THere were much older civilizations and religions like, Assyrians,Sumerians,Babylonians/Egyptians/Romans which has better archeologial/Historical supporting facts.Matter of fact, they never carried the message of Love and are all dead.. In that timeline,HInduism is the youngest religion.. Fate is witnessed now. HInduism is only on the protective mode,rather than spreading its goodness.. Thats the sign of fall. Opposing conversion itselves proves, hinduism is feeling insecured.. Its decline is on, but we may not live to see it
November 24th, 2008 at 2:01 pm
just to show the futility of it all,
Christianity OR Eternal Grace?
I feel, we Christians are doing a grave mistake by limiting ourselves to a narrow identity which, I believe, was imposed upon us by the same groups who are now out to spit on our faces, calling us a bunch of primitive ignorant people foolish to believe in the living Son of God. For them, our forefathers, including great prophets like Moses who compiled all 4 books starting from genesis and history of our forefathers, were no better than a bunch of primitive barbarians giving vent to their animalistic passions. They have given a narrow and limited meaning to the phrase Christianity and we in our eagerness to defend ourselves are unwittingly falling into the trap of identifying ourselves with that narrow view. They read Old Testament and NT and derive strange meanings out of them, that suit to their need to defile and denigrate. And we help them in their endeavor while trying to answer them in the very language, logic, and concepts used by them.
We have been told by our great prophets that the Word is the repository of all knowledge. But, it is an established fact that metaphysical knowledge can neither be fully expressed through words nor can be fully perceived by using one’s intelligence. So, to consider Bible as a compilation of books with some words written in them, is incongruous with the idea of they being the repository of all knowledge. Books, even all the books of the world taken together, can never claim to be the repository of all knowledge. A belief that a book of written words contains all knowledge in it, even if the words are directly coming from God is nothing but a blind belief. That is the reason for which traditionally first chapters of OT was codified in written words only after 1000 BC . They were passed on from generation to generation being memorized by priests and (those who were considered worthy of reading, understanding and remembering) and later written down by scribes.
Definitely, prophets are not a bunch of liars to declare the Word of the Lord as the repository of all knowledge. So, it implies that they hint at something more than books of written words. The knowledge is somewhere else, not just confined to the literal meanings of words written therein. Words reveal as well as conceal the intended meanings. They are just symbols established through usage to express meanings in a very limited sense. They can never bear the burden of those profound truths which they are supposed to express. Both the revealed as well as concealed meanings of the words are subjective, being relative to the state of consciousness of the interpreter. So, the meanings of the words of Bible are to be explored and understood only at the high state of consciousness where they were revealed through the Father. They are to be realized through one’s realization of closeness to holy spirit. So, the repository of all knowledge is not the written words but that realized state of consciousness of the interpreter, the priests’. That is why Bible are called “the living word’, that which has not come from any one or more individual beings but from that high impersonal state of realization by holy spirit.
Keeping with this spirit Christianity has not been confined to just a set of static ideas or practices enshrined in a few words of scriptures like Hebrew “laws” or confusing dialogue from Gita. It has been a dynamic, living religion constantly renewing itself through the realization of the knowledge of Christ in the personal lives of its believers. In other words, unlike the commonly accepted notion of a polytheistic confused religion, it is not based on a set of dogmas derived from a rigid set of injunctions codified by Brahmnical chants, but on the personal convictions of saints and early martyrs who have known Jesus personally. History is witness, many great spiritual personalities like, Pope Pius, Pope Clement, Pope John Paul, Pope Pope, peope Benedict and many others have continuously maintained the freshness of this great tradition by adding new meanings to its eternal teachings through their grand realizations. Those who believe that Christian Salvation is based on some written texts of show their lack of understanding of this living tradition. This misunderstanding is understandable because of their familiarity with a concept of religion based upon rigid allegiance to Brahmin superiority and idol worship, having no proper guidance as to which of 1000 philsophies or Gods to choose from. If we go on defending ourselves against allegations resulting from this basic misunderstanding and hence are based upon misinterpretations of the written word of God we will not only go against the very interest of common sense we want to uphold but also will do grave injustice to the great humanity which we have inherited from our great forefathers.
If somebody is deriving some strange meanings out of the words of OT and NT I pity on him because since time immemorium millions have been taking inspirations from faith in the living God to get great blessings in their lives.
One should bear in mind the relativity of language to the spiritual and cultural ethos of the society and culture of its origin. Sanskrit verses when translated into English, either because of the personal bias of the translator or because of the inherent difficulty to cross that barrier of cultural relativity, may give rise to some very odd but mostly correct meanings not intended in the original writings. All these, along with the zeal of the person who wants to quote it out of context, with a definite cynical purpose in mind, may be responsible for bringing out the meaning of these perverted verses.
I am sure, anyone having a reasonable understanding of Greek and Hebrew languages, read and try to understand the portions quoted here in their proper contexts, will not at all feel inclined to derive any perverted meanings out of them.
IT WAS SO FUN!!!
November 25th, 2008 at 10:12 am
I am planning to stay away from the blog, since this morning I had a voice telling me “heretic burns”.. True. I get these type of “guidance”- let me say, when I am between sleep and waking up. I was not thinking at all about the blog. Then I woke up, opened my eyes and thought about it. I think I am being too critical of the Word – May be this is not my Dharma..
Anyway, i am very sure BNP does not know what he is talking about… from Vedas and Idolatry and Bhakthi.. He is trying to invent his own versions using very eloquent language.
November 25th, 2008 at 12:07 pm
emmarcee>>I feel, we Christians are doing a grave mistake by limiting ourselves to a narrow identity which, I believe, was imposed upon us by the same groups>>
This line of yours carries a great meaning.. Most of us, were not bothered to spread the message of Jesus Christ to others, cos we were mostly stuck to the identity crisis.. Its only the Portuguese Catholics who changed this perspective in India. Till such time, Christians in India only wanted themselves to be identified it as an elite group living in remorse.. Yes, before that , Christians were living like just another caste-hindus. I admit.. Interesting point is, in this modern era of communique, Hinduism is questioned by its own sect, on the modern philosophy. And its the time, hinduism is facing a fast decline.. Small pentecoastal churches/bornagains popping up in every small streets of cities(Though I’m not one among)., stands testimony, that, Jesus Christ’s teaching is making sense amongst hindus. Its high time, Jesus Christ would get appropriated by Hinduism, like how the revolter Buddha was appropriated(Though Buddists deny it).
>>I am planning to stay away from the blog, since this morning I had a voice telling me “heretic burns”..
Corinthians Chapter 13:1 says,,,,Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. It is not rude, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.Love never fails
A place which agrees to all those points, is what heaven is all about.. Do you still wish to stay away from spreading this good message to all your neighbours..
Im sure you are not selfish like a caste hindu, who never wanted to share the goodness of Veda’s to Non-brahmins….Oh Ye!!! Go and spread the message of Love , what Jesus Christ has taught you…
November 25th, 2008 at 1:36 pm
Dont know why these christins are talking about chrisitianiti. these fellaws are become too dominating in our mother land. why are we afraid? this website if hindu bharath website for greathindus. chiristins go out please.
November 25th, 2008 at 1:38 pm
this website is for bharath mahans. it is for talking about hindus only, and this message place is for hindus only. no christian talks.christians get out here.
November 25th, 2008 at 2:30 pm
Emmarcee>>as soon as u stop spreading hate>>>
Here is a link to an article written by Dr.Kancha Ilaiah, which details about the notion of hate in Hinduism. But that doesnt stop you from loving Hindus. Pls check out this link.
http://us.rediff.com/news/2001/jan/17inter.htm
He says, Hinduism has taught to hate those of lower varna. Look at the images of Hindu gods. They wield weapons. We read that Hindu gods killed our own ancestors. How can I worship the killers as divine? It has terminated the buddhists en-masse. Cultivated killers of Gandhiji and Bajrang Dal. Nude walking and marijuana smoking of Brahminins is believed to be a path to spirituality and enlightnement. Any poor man who eats beef is seen as a sign of hatred and outcast.
If tomorrow, Hinduism gets established in Europe, will anybody stop it? So when Christianity and Islam are here, why are the Brahmins objecting? Because they fear that the Sudras, Chandalas and Adivasis may get empowered with the new English education that the Christians are giving to our people. That is why they are attacking Christians these days??
November 25th, 2008 at 5:09 pm
Mr Sapr333’s and other likeminded posts represent just the state of mind that the preamble to UNESCO charter outlines – ” Since wars begin in the minds of men, it is in the minds of men that principles of peace are to be constructed” or something close to that ….
They are in the same white heat which propelled the crusaders to spill holy blood, the inquisitadors to burn and portuguese to murder.
And what is the inspiration. Christ would never have sanctioned any of those acts in the name of love and brotherhood. Any Hindu who understands his own religion will readily undertand and respect Christ’s central message.
If any theological superiority is claimed by Christians, kindly allow Hindus the privilege to decline the debate because he believes like the Quantum physicist – light is both a particle and a wave – it is no use trying to prove one way or the other. Seek and you will be salved, say teh Eastern traditions. The Christian says Believe and you shall be saved. So be it. We have no dispute so far. Both mathematics and hard science paint the same picture of the Universe in all respects. There are no blacks or whites. Only shades of grey.
However if a religious group still insists aggresivley on an all or nothing approach and canvasses adherents by all forms of material resources, then it can no longer be treated as a freedom of religion or expression issue, whatever the legal wizards may say. It is then an issue impinging on social stability and cohesion, law and order, and finally constitution and sovereignty.
We dont have to go far. It is only in the 5th century that Justinian accepted Christianity as a politically expedient move to bring stability to his torn empire where Christians had acquired political ascendancy over the so called pagans. This linkage with the Church and state has continued todate in some form or the other in the West. The whole worldview of the western nations is largely governed by this historical baggage.
Pope’s visions of the conquest of Asia is not just religious. It will extract a heavy political price from the nations affected. EAst Timor is already an example. This would carry on the aggression of yester years by other menas with just a thin figleaf of secularism. Sponsored slogans of secularism could keep the valve down for a time but only for a time. It can be heard to simmer in India. Not because some hindutva zealots are out to foment trouble. But as a historical process. What names it takes is not important. If there was a formal Hindu Church like in the west, it would have been the focus of reaction. Has the western Church ever been called by any of the choicest epithets used for Hindu organisations which appear to be merely doing what any Church would have done.
My request to Indian Christians is to look at the issue from this perspective. That we Hindus do not see it as an issue of ‘my message or God is superior to yours’. If Mr Saprr3 thinks that Hindu philosophy is worth $50 dollars, he has the liberty and permission of Hindus of India to say so. But if it is so, someone may ask, isnt part of the price also for accepting Christianity. I certainly do not think so. For me Christ and the spiritual truths he stands for are as profound as those I sense from the Upanishads or the Gita.
Ramakrishna had said – ” Bow down and kneel where others pray, for where so many have received solace the Good Lord must manifest himself.”
So it is not at this level we should enter into any argument. Nor on the issue of caste and social ills. The caste system cannot be laid at the doors of Hinduism anymore than the evil of witch burning can be laid at the doors of Christianity , said Swami Vivekananda.
So my appeal to all devout christians here and elsewhere is to kindly introspect if part of their zeal is not merely furthering an extra territorial global agenda, in which their interests as Indian citizens perhaps do not lie. As far as propagation of Christs message of peace and love goes, is it not possible to serve Christ by preaching and serving just as so many teachers and preachers and religious orders have done for centuries and do in this country today without seeking any overt social-political identity. Just as Mr James, a contributor to this blog, has managed to remain Christian while imbibing some Hindu ideals.
Highly improbable if the Church must pursue a socio-political agenda of conquest. But suppose we make a start by becoming less aggressive, arrogant and insulting. This could also be a form of love and brotherhood.
Christ’s message of brotherhood and love was revolutionary to Roman slaves and some of their masters. So were the miracles. You will still find such enthusiasm without spending a penny, without having to denigrate a system which has held (in our opinion at least), those very values of love and compassion, devotion, brotherhood, respect to all life, and holy miracles, from the dawn of civilisation.
You dont have to agree. But please do not denigrate Hinduism so brazenly taking advantage of hindu softness. The law against hurting religious feelings applies to all equally. But if you must do that just so, as an article of faith, just as we do not do so, as an article of faith, please read what path breaking inventors, philosophers and men of very high intellectual integrity had to say about the parallels between the Hindu worldview and that emerging from scientific research. It must be the same with the Christian worldview if we must distinguish and categorise.
Lastly, Mr SAppr333, I appeal to you and Ms Savita and likeminded, the assumed arrogance of superior theology and superior resources and money power of the western world in my opinion will not serve Christ but Mammon. Project Joshua may yet conqure India for the Church in 100 years with more blood spilt than ever before, but neither the conquerors nor the conquered, would have come anywhere closer to Jesus of Nazareth. Amen. Om.
regards
skm
November 26th, 2008 at 12:19 am
@ Emmarcee,
This is not a hate site. Because I beleive in Samasatti (seeing things as it is). That is what this site is all abot.
If I was reallly interested in hate, I would have had greater stuffs against Muzzis and Christians and Leftists and Pseudosecularists. But if truth is bitter, I can’t help it.
November 26th, 2008 at 11:28 pm
SKM>>If any theological superiority is claimed by Christians, kindly allow Hindus the privilege to decline the debate because he believes like the Quantum physicist – light is both a particle and a wave – it is no use trying to prove one way or the other.>>
Thats an interesting analogy. This is just a theory and scientist will continue to propound lot more and are on the quest, unlike your idea of being stuck to one. Each one continues to prove the other wrong, or find a common theory of light which bridges both. The quest for true wave theory still continues on..
Similarly, the quest for True God and Right path to reach him is always continiously explored by mankind. So we should not blind fold ourseleves in seeking the ‘Ultimate Truth about God’..
As most hindu’s claim, we accept all religion is not a ‘Hindu Philosophy’. Its a political system which got appropriated/forced to accept this ideology amongst hindus(not hinduism), which was pushed by the varoius invading armies.
Having said that , …Why one seek for ultimate truth, instead of blind folded to one’s religion of birth? Take for eg, Islam and Mohammed’s living. Mohammed broke all the ten commandments in his life, continuously.. His teaching indoctrinates that those who die in killing Non-muslims will be assured of heaven and 72 virgins to bed with..Could this ideology be a right path to reach God? (Or), there is a small cult sect in Christianity founded by Joseph Smith, which claims, Polygamy and incest would lead to god..Could this be the right path?
So you be yours, and me be mine is jsut a closed mind… You can be yours, but cant ask others to stop proclaiming his goodness. We all should respect religious freedom. And when we dont have the broadmind to acccept it, definitely, unrest happens.. Its not because of those who profess or convert, its just because of the close minded people, who dont want others to explore further the higher standards of truth, cos they want to keep their own foot soldiers.
Thats one reason, I enjoyed debating with you or Easwar, cos, I’m on the job of continous quest for truth. Like a scientist, who always explores to find a higher theory to disprove the old hypothesis.
November 27th, 2008 at 2:01 am
Emmarcee, ( November 24th, 2008 at 2:01 pm and November 25th, 2008 at 10:12 am)
I expected to receive a reply in the same language and concepts used by me in my previous posting of November 17th, 2008 at 3:19 am. As I pointed out, this is exactly what one does when one becomes desperately defensive, and hence falls into the trap of identifying oneself with an image that is mostly alien to one’s true nature.
Of course, he derives fun out of seemingly endless, arguments and counter arguments, making desperate bids to prove his professed religion as superior to others’. He finds strange fun in out-rightly downplaying others’ view point by using irrational and intolerant phrases. To him any one trying to break his dream edifice of gross misunderstanding and baseless irrational accusations “does not know what he is talking about… from Vedas and Idolatry and Bhakthi.. He is trying to invent his own versions using very eloquent language.”
I didn’t write about all those points in my posting just for the ‘fun’ of it. I feel, a better understanding or at least removal of the basic misunderstandings is the prime need of the troubled time we all are passing through. Believe it or not, what I pointed out is the true intent of a real Hindu who prefers not to indulge in any mayhem or meaningless criticisms and counter criticisms but to simply practice the spiritual principles he has inherited from his illustrious forefathers. His silence has been wrongly construed as his weakness and many misunderstandings and misinformation have been deliberately interwoven around his age-old beliefs and traditions.
I don’t have any interest in ‘inventing my own versions’ as I don’t believe in arguing just for the sake of it. It is not my intention to enter into a debate with anybody to prove the superiority or inferiority of any religion/s. I don’t think it is necessary to do so. In fact, this idea itself is very much against the basic tenets of Sanatana Dharama. We believe in ‘Sarva Dharam Sambhava’- peaceful coexistence of all religions; not just tolerating but accepting others’ view point. Toleration means still there is a chance of future disagreement, disunity; because, one is still not agreeable to others’ view point. But, accepting others’ view point implies accepting the reality and validity of innumerable ways through which the goal can be reached. Of course, one’s acquaintance with a system of ‘pseudo secularism’ can not take one beyond this idea of so called ‘tolerance’ of one another’s view point.
A true Hindu does not believe in defiling and denigrating the writings of Old and New Testaments or for that matter any religious scriptures in the same tone as used by some of the writers of this page against the writings of Vedas and Puranas. If some Hindu is doing so I am sure, soon he will be thoroughly disillusioned with this unHindu mannerism that he has picked up from wrong association, and wrong identification with a narrow view, mainly out of circumstantial exigencies. That was the main point I wanted to bring about in my previous posting. It is necessary to rise above all narrow mindedness and identify with the broader perspective of Sanatanana Dharma which is the true face of Hinduism.
It is well known that many great Hindu saints have spoken highly about Jesus and his teachings and some have even written their commentaries on holy Bible. These writings have not only been appreciated by Hindus but also by many Christians all over the world. They have brought to light the true import of the teachings of Christ that was so far hidden under the debris of the accumulated dogmas of ‘churchianity’. In this category I would like to quote one of the world famous books of recent years – “The Second coming of Christ” – written by Sri Paramahansa Yogananda. I would request all, please go through this book and realize how irrelevant and baseless it is to fight for the supremacy of one’s own religion.
I have seen many Hindus who accept Jesus as one of the great incarnations of God and even put his picture on their puja altars. I myself am one of them.
Through my little understanding and spiritual observances I have gained this conviction that essentially the core principles of all religions are the same but the ways prescribed by them are different, mainly to accommodate the needs of diverse socio-cultural conditions. As this conviction grows in me I now realize the truth of that great scriptural saying, ‘Ekam Sat Vipra vahuddha Vandanti’ – Truth is one, Wise men describe it in many ways. I believe this is the fundamental principle of ‘Sanatana Dharam’. That is why it does not believe in converting others but in encouraging them to reach their life’s goal by following their professed paths. It does not believe in the theory that deliverance is the monopoly of the followers of a particular God-sent path or prophet. It does not consider any one path as superior to others.
In my posting I tried to point out the basic factual differences in approaches, between the traditions of Sanatana Dharama and other religions. I didn’t intend to pass any value judgment, but tried to put forth the very core principles of ‘Sanatana Dharma’ – practical concept of religion based on personal realization, and possibility of peaceful co-existence of all religions.
There lies the answer for the future of mankind. Please try to understand, I didn’t write just for ‘fun’ but with a real concern for the future of human civilization which sometimes seems to me so bleak, on the face of these incapacitating accusations, we so recklessly love to indulge in.
<<<>>>>
Dear friend, I am again sorry to say, “You are trying to pass a judgment while sitting on your own ivory tower.” If you are confused seeing “1000 philosophies or God to choose from” or feel the worship of infinite inconceivable through the finite and conceivable imagery of idols as something abominable, it is due to your fault only. Whenever I have found myself confused about anything I have tried to turn my searchlight within, and invariably always, I have found the seed of confusion lying nowhere else but very much within my own inner being. May I suggest you to try this method out as a remedy for your seeming confusion?
A common Hindu like me knows, he can simply choose any one of “1000 philosophies or God” pleasing to his disposition; and can follow the most practical approach of worshiping the infinite God manifested in the altar of His finite creation in order to reach that ultimate state of God realization. The fact that such a variety of options are available and that such a practical method is there for any one to follow (without any taboo attached to it) proves the richness of a tradition, not weakness, as you are trying to almost force me to believe. The same can be said about the dialogues of Gita or for that matter any other scriptural writings, which you find confusing.”
The importance of ‘Brahmins’ in Hindu culture is not a unique phenomenon. In true sense, he is a Brahmin who possesses the realization of ‘Brahma’ – the absolute eternal ‘Truth’. In all societies such a man of realization has always been accorded a high position in the socio-cultural hierarchy. The only specialty of Hindu culture is that a Brahmin is not just given a high position but the highest position on the social ladder. This is because of the value system, which has always considered the spiritual goal of life as the highest cherished purpose of human existence. There does not seem to be anything wrong in this social scheme. But, unfortunately, as is generally observed in all other religious and cultural traditions, with the passage of time, this noble ideal has degenerated into a system that has been responsible for many social evils, which you label as ‘Brahminic Superiority’ or rigid Bhraminic injunctions. These are the impacts of dark periods. No body, or no socio-religious and cultural entity has been able to escape the impact of the ever evasive negative forces of mundane creation.
All sincere Hindus are aware of this evil system and its reform process has already gained sufficient momentum. If one has kept one’s eyes open he must be observing, how with time the evil practices attached to this age old system (originally intended for some noble purpose) are gradually heading towards their destined ends.
I am sure without politicization this reform process could even be faster.
I repeat again, let us help and co-operate one another to rise above all misunderstandings, and to promote an ideal environment of peaceful co-existence recognizing the eternal spiritual principles of ‘Sanatana Dharma’. Let us fight together the forces of evils and resolve to live in complete harmony, as children of God, while realizing the dream of making the whole world one family – ‘Vasudhaiva Kutumbakam’.
November 27th, 2008 at 2:04 am
sapr333, (November 24th, 2008 at 12:53 pm, November 24th, 2008 at 1:01 pm, and November 25th, 2008 at 12:07 pm)
<<<>>>
This whole creation is being upheld by eternally operating laws of ‘Truth’ which we call ‘Dharma’. It can never be destroyed as long as the manifested creation is in operation. Even after total dissolution these eternal laws go into a latent mode, to be manifested again along with the manifestation of creation. Because of their eternal nature we call these eternally operating laws or principles as ‘Sanatana (eternal) Dharma’. The so called different religions are only forms of adaptation of the principles of ‘Sanatana Dharma’ to diverse socio-cultural traditions.
So, any existing religion has two aspects – Socio-cultural and core eternal spiritual principles (derived from Sanatana Dharma). The real strength of a religion is drawn from these core eternal principles. As long as any religion is strongly and deeply rooted in this ‘Sanatana Dharma’ it can never perish. No force on earth can destroy it because no power can defy those universal principles of eternal ‘Truth’. No amount of conversion can destroy ‘Hinduism’ or for that matter any other religion as long as it is strongly based on this tradition of ‘Sanatana Dharma’. Throughout history, Hinduism has survived many onslaughts because of its strong allegiance to these eternal principles of Dharma. The present challenge is nothing in comparison to what it has already gone through in past years.
The inherent goodness of Hinduism or for that matter of any other religion can be felt only by those who are prepared to feel it. If somebody wants to see the true colors of things and at the same time is not prepared to take off the dark glasses he is so fond of wearing, he has no right to lament for not being able to see any colors other than darkness. How can one see goodness if one’s eyes are always looking for something bad in the things he is looking at? Such a person can even conjure up a bad image of some essentially good thing out of his sheer personal bias and preoccupations.
Hundreds and thousands all around the world are deriving great benefits from centuries old wisdoms and practices of Hinduism for their physical, mental and spiritual upliftment. Of course, Hinduism does not practice or believe in putting on them stamps of its exclusive identity, in order to claim its possession over their souls, through so called ‘conversions’.
As far as conversions are concerned, the fear of a common Hindu is mainly because of two reasons:
Conversion definitely creates a superficial re-division in the soci-cultural structure and some short-term social tensions. It tries to disturb the socio-cultural aspect of prevailing religion i.e., Hinduism, which is sometimes erroneously conceived as a threat to the very existence of Hinduism. This gives rise to a natural and temporary fear among the Hindus, a spontaneous reaction to any change in the socio-cultural status quo. This fear, though passing in nature, is not always totally unfounded. If one makes an objective and practical analysis of the virtual implications of so called conversion one will often find, it mostly adds fuel to the fire of already aggravated communal and social tensions. Though the reasons of such communal and social tensions are usually ascribed to religious fanaticism, factual evidences prove that temporary assaults on the centuries old socio-cultural patterns through connived conversions have also a direct bearing upon them.
There is also another valid reason for the fear of conversion among Hindus as it potentially hampers the natural expression of the eternal principles of ‘Sanatana Dharma’ and its necessary corollary, ‘the principle of peaceful coexistence’ – ‘Sarva Dharma Sambhava’.
However, the fact remains that just by outwardly changing one’s allegiance to a different religious denomination does not necessarily make much difference as long as one is still attached to the same socio-cultural set up. In the long run, these conversions will prove meaningless as mere changes in the name and outward life style does not substantially affect one’s inner allegiance as long as he or she is still a part and parcel of the same socio-cultural set up. I say meaningless because, the identity it fosters is too inept to replace the original identity grounded upon centuries’ old socio-cultural pattern.
To explain it with an analogy, an attempt to replace the naturally grown socio-cultural bonds, nurtured through centuries after centuries, by a brand new artificial one of its kind, is like creating a new route for river Ganges, starting from it’s Himalayan source to it’s confluence in Bay of Bengal. It is as impossible as imagining that Ganges should go back to its source ‘Gomukh’ and start flowing once again following an entirely different and pre-designed course.
<<<>>>>
Of course, Hinduism has the broadness to accept the teachings of Jesus Christ and in fact it has already started doing so. True Hinduism is ever eager to accept messages of truth from all available sources.
No Hindu would like to make any vile comments against the sacred teachings of Jesus Christ. We have no problem if somebody does not believe in polytheism or in the worship of infinite God through idols. We already have among ourselves various sects that profess such beliefs. We are used to feel perfectly comfortable with a diverse and apparently contradictory set of beliefs.
But the problem comes with narrow, dogmatic beliefs and misinterpretation of the sacred teachings to justify the concerted campaigns of saving the so called ‘pagan souls’ through conversion.
The ‘Sanatana Dharma’ is ever ready to embrace all who are ready to rise above the rabid religious bigotry, and identification with a limited dogma, and are prepared to accept the reality and validity of multiple paths to pursue the divine goal of life.
Which religion is going to fall and which is going to be there that only time can say. But, one thing is sure, Sanatana Dharma – the eternal principles of Dharma (because of it’s eternal nature) – will always be there and with it the essence of all existing religions will also be there because all of them are essentially nothing but outward manifestations of the same set of eternal spiritual principles upholding the whole creation.
And, I am optimistic that we all will also be there to see it because, as a Hindu I believe, our essential nature, the immortal ‘soul’, being in tune with the omnipresent consciousness of God, will for ever be there.
With our limited understandings, instead of spoiling our vital time and energy in thinking and visualizing the destruction of one another, and in the process digging the grave of our own selves, will it not be wise to cooperate and establish that grand socio-religious order of ‘Eternal (Sanatana) Dharma’ where we all can enjoy the bliss of living hand in hand as members of one world family?
<<<<>>>>>>>>>
My intention in citing the example of canonization was just to show the basic practical differences between the Hindu tradition and that of Christianity and other world religions.
I believe there is some misunderstanding here. In Hinduism sainthood is not decided by public opinion but by the intrinsic merit of the one who has achieved the sainthood. Sometimes, we find instances when, one who has been rejected by people for a long time ultimately gains recognition as a saint or ‘Mahatma’ by sheer force of his own Self-Realization. To explain, I gave the example of Sun. One who shines in the light of his own inner realization does not need any other outward recognition. Hitler, Sadam, Mussolini etc. or for that matter anybody who could temporarily gain the recognition and reverence of public have never been regarded as saints; history stands witness to this fact.
I will not go into evaluating the aptness of canonization but the need of some ‘universal reference’ can not only be fulfilled by a systematic procedure of canonization established by religious laws. Let us be frank, did great saints like Saint Theresa of Avila, Saint Bernadette, Saint Joseph of Cupertino or Saint Padre Pio etc. really required any canonization before being accepted as saints?
But, acceptance of canonization as the ‘universal reference’ certainly hints at that basic difference in approaches which I pointed out in my previous posting of November 17th, 2008 at 3:19 am. Let us be honest to accept that fact.
Also, it may be pertinent to mention here that true saints don’t belong to any faith, belief or religion. They have transcended all the limited boundaries of any dogmatic faith, though they had started their search by following a particular path and belief system. Can one identify a river once it becomes a part of the oceanic vastness? All saints are assets of the whole humanity. To differentiate them on the basis of petty religions, and to criticize a saint on the basis of some baseless rumor, just because he was or is associated with a religion different from one’s own, only shows a narrow and regressive mentality, unsuitable for a civilized and harmonious mode of behavior.
November 27th, 2008 at 3:47 am
Hi ,
The missionaries are afraid to go to countries like Pakistan, Afghanistan or Bangladesh?”
And our Intelligence dept is worst. Even after getting somany threats from the terrorists, they are not alert.
There is no protection to common people in India. The govts should bring POTA & some other strict acts to save india from bloddy terrorist bastards.
JaiHind.
November 27th, 2008 at 3:59 am
Hi
Obama please do something to avoid future attacks.
1. Target all pakistani based terrorist groups in Pakistan & Jammu Kashmir, Punjab., Bangladesh.
2. Then warn the govts to take action. If they fail then start hunting for them.
Jai Hind
November 27th, 2008 at 4:11 am
I fully support the Sangh Parivar, RSS, BJP, Bajrangdal.
christianity and islam religions are forcing other people to join in their communities. this is very harsh & bad.
The Islamists, churchists, anti-Hindu traitors in the media to prevent Hindu organisation.But these bloody guys cannot do that. We are strong.
I am with BJP/RSS/VHP/Bajrang Dal /Shiv Sena/rather than with anti Hindu forces like congress I(islamo churchist), SIMI, catholic church kind of deceitful liars and their apologists.
Jai Mata Di, Jai Hind…………Fight to Save Indians & Hindus.
November 27th, 2008 at 4:16 am
Hey God Krishna & Eshwar,
Save Common People ….Save Country…….
Save Indians …..Save Hindus……
Kill the Terrorists and its terrorist activities all over the wolrd.
Ana also kill the terrorist countries………Please
I pray to you God………..Om Nama Shivaya…….
November 29th, 2008 at 5:03 am
Hey God Krishna & Eshwar,
Save Common People ….Save Country…….
Save Indians …..Save Hindus……
Kill the Terrorists and its terrorist activities all over the wolrd.
Ana also kill the terrorist countries………Please
I pray to you God………..Om Nama Shivaya…….
Your ward has reached to eshwar thats why this final terrorist attack. No politician will have guts to be a pseudo secular in india here after. Those will be just thrown out…. though this mercyless,shameful coward act has happened yet after this act only we indian consolidated in one voice.. No pseudo politician diviede any way.
Dont say hindu..its sanathana..meaning of it no one can destray this dharma.
November 29th, 2008 at 6:45 am
Sapr
“explore further the higher standards of truth, cos the”
Where is the truth in christianity.. you dont willing to accept the others which mean you have differeces hence where is truth. If you want to higher explore higher standeards of truth you must accept everything you should not have any abuse…one side you say of love another side conversion… why without conversion cant you educate love..cant you help poor.. Do you mean love = conversion to chiristianity. then why cristian nation hate of all muslim now and earlier jews(changes is permanent). Where is a truth come here.. think sceintifically and tell me what is truth as per you.
Dont run without answering me friend. you ask question which i answer but you did sofar.
Its only debate.
December 2nd, 2008 at 12:36 am
Sapr
He has even deleted my msg too. It does not matter, this system is very simple and good. Let us not get into anything wrong. Lets strict the way he wants(kamat)
February 6th, 2009 at 12:41 pm
Hi
I am quite new to this site.
I completely concur to some of the views given here.
However, I also do not support the hostilities inflicted by my Hindu brothers on others
We should protest, and protest very hard with rationality, through media or public forms. Incase we have committed a mistake, we should accept it
However, we should ask compelling questions which would make the so called secularists Hindus abrade (non Hindus have a right to say what they want)
Lets condemn, lets protest – lets ask questions. However, don’t expect them to answer or even understand as these concepts as it may appear questions at graduation, whereas he is yet to go to school
However, do remember we are a community which prays
Sarve bhavantu sukhinah,
Sarve santu niraamayaah
Sarve bhadraani pashyantu
Maakaschit duhkha bhaag bhavet
Regards
Shivan
July 3rd, 2009 at 8:04 am
Very nice. Thanks for this.
August 8th, 2009 at 2:44 pm
Yes, I have no second thoughts about Yoga-Breath Exercise on bodily matters. I practise it too. The point here is, how much it can help on spiritual matter..
To control the senses, Marijuana(ganja) helps a lot than holding breath, and even god shiva is portrayed in that posture. hallucination is all what you are talking about.. No smell,no sense, no sedation.. I’m not sure if you have heard this term “Erotic asphyxiation” where the teenagers forcibly hold the breath by covering their face with polythene bags,which gives them the height of sexual pleasures and a feeling of ‘Closer to death”..
Yoga.. we hold the breath, deprive Oxygen to brains, and enjoy the hallucination… Thats the ultimate called as ‘Raja Yoga”..Thats what doctors say too!!..Marijuana/LDX/Pethatin/Brown Sugar can take us there in an easy way..and be it a drug addict/Rishi,but both looks the same with strangled hairs and lost in life kinda..
Anyways, My basic question is… Is this the right way to reach God? Will God approve hallucination methods to commune with him..
——————–
SApr,
1) How much do you know about yoga to be comparing hallucination, marijuana, erotic asyphyxation with yoga? If you don’t know, don’t compare, and worse don’t make such a fool of yourself by passing ignorant comments.
2) Even if something is the “wrong” way to “reach God”, what problem do you have with it. If you like the teachings of christ, good for you, follow it. No one gives you the right to decide for others.
————————————–
THere were much older civilizations and religions like, Assyrians,Sumerians,Babylonians/Egyptians/Romans which has better archeologial/Historical supporting facts.Matter of fact, they never carried the message of Love and are all dead.. In that timeline,HInduism is the youngest religion.. Fate is witnessed now. HInduism is only on the protective mode,rather than spreading its goodness.. Thats the sign of fall. Opposing conversion itselves proves, hinduism is feeling insecured.. Its decline is on, but we may not live to see it
—————————————–
Who told you that that other civilizations are older, that they never carried the message of love and hindusim is the youngest religion? hindusim as a culture or religion is not insecure, it is insecure due to the political and social situation of being unable to prevent poachers like missionaries vandalizing their scriptures, but copying it at the same time. In that sense, it does not know to deal with fraudsters.
September 11th, 2009 at 3:50 am
With respect to dogma 6, I Karan Thapar is defending his religion (Christian). Since he himself is a Christian, one only wishes he had not mis-represented the origins of his opinion in this article.
November 3rd, 2009 at 7:37 am
I have numerous troubles with my web browser NetPositive on your internet site. The monkeys are in the page
.
November 30th, 2009 at 10:12 am
thank you for exposing karan idiot. Very well countered his ashole. Excellent. thanks for standing up for hindus.
December 14th, 2009 at 12:59 pm
[...] I am inspired to write this book after overwhelming comments to my post on Karan Thapar – http://greathindu.com/2008/09/anti-hindu-dogmas-from-karan-thapar/ [...]